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blue girl

"Republicans think the deal is that the right to filibuster will be preserved only as long as the Democrats promise never to use it."

I don't care how both sides spin this -- you are absolutely right.

Rook: http://www.rooksrant.com/

...is more optimistic.

I guess all we can do is wait and watch. But, I am so aggravated with the Democratic party. They keep calling me for money. I'm not giving anymore.

I'm thinking of jumping ship! Problem is -- where would I land?

Lance

Blue Girl, The Democrats didn't fail this time. They were holding firm. It was Lieberman and the other "moderates." Where you should land is with whoever challenges DeWine next year. Me, I'm going to be giving money to whichever real Democrat challenges Lieberman in a primary.

grishaxxx

Blue Girl - don't jump ship just yet. I wish I could find it - thought it was something Amanda passed on at Pandagon, but it's eluding me - but the legal wisdom in TX is that the 5th Circuit, for which Owens is being put forth, is pretty much fucked anyway, so letting her get by won't make that much difference in the makeup there. I think stuff like that has to be taken into account. Owens may be a malignant idiot, but letting her go is a chip, and it won't change the character of the Circuit anyway, so....
I think we are gaining more than we're losing on these three. Take heart.

coturnix

Check out Publius' analysis on Legal Fiction (lawandfiction.blogspot.com).

denisdekat

Democrats did not win a thing, they continue to loose...

It is like this Chess master I once knew (who kicked everyone's butt at chess at our local Cafe), once said to me...

I use to play this huge large man who had the worst coffee breath you can imagine. Anyhow, he use to instantly go on the attack and corner me into all sorts of humiliating retreats. For a long time I thought he would win by distracting me and ruining my concentration with a slow subtle series of the most stinkiest of soft burpy gasses I have ever smelled (slowly being released via his breath - smelled like something died down there, let me tell you). He one day said to me "you give your opponent two options, one is worse than the other". The idea was that you stay on the offensive giving the opponent the illusion that he has some control by giving him two choices. In reality, both choices are controlled by you and both choices lead either to long term or short term defeat of the opponent...

Sound familiar?

So... The Democrats loose big again...

blue girl

I agree with DenisDekat -- the dorky Democrats didn't win a thing. (If I can't do anything else, I'm just going to start calling them names) And the right will get the Supreme Court they want. Just watch.

The only fun thing has been watching the right rips itself apart. They are nuts.

Has anyone heard Buchanan today? He's going ballistic.

Michael G

And I thought I was the only one who couldn't stand that weasly little scold of a Lieberman. I agree that it appears the Dems didn't win much of anything except that with a ten vote minority they did manage to keep the filibuster rule from being changed. I think we need to see how the individual nomination votes pan out and especially to see how the expected summer Supreme Court vacancy(ies) work. It is nice to see so many of the "conservative" wing nuts frothing over this.

Zach

I have to say I dont agree at all. Putting aside the involvement of old Trail O' Slime Ho-Joe, Im entirely with Steve G on this one:

http://stevegilliard.blogspot.com/2005/05/dobson-threat.html


Jim Dobson is, at this moment, the SINGLE most dangerous individual to the stability of this democracy. And he is bonkers pissed about this compromise.

On those grounds alone, we came up positive on balance.

It sucks weasels to be the party out of power to do almost anything. Nothing can really soften that. Still this is the first actual hard-fought "opposition" action our small, weary little Resistance has made stick, and for that they get my thanks and the handful of quarters I can spare.

Lance

Zach, you have a good point, but as Dave points out over at Lawyers, Guns and Money, Dobson is always hopping mad. It's his only emotion. He gets mad if a Democrat, a woman, or a smart alecky child looks at him sideways. Making him mad is so easy that it's not a selling point here.

The other thing is that the deal depends on the moderate Republicans holding the rest of their colleagues to it the first time the Democrats try to stop a nominee.

It may be the best thing we could have hoped for, but it is not a victory, only a postponement of the big fight.

Michael

I was inclined, at first, to think that the so-called compromise reached here was another horrible example of Dem spinelessness. On reflection, though, I have to think that Reid came out of this affair with about the best deal possible. Crucially, I think he's made it likely that we can avoid the theocratic worst in the next Supreme Court nominee.

If you look carefully at the logic of the agreement, understanding that this is centrally a power play on the part of the GOP signatories—the mavericks—then it's clear that the filibuster is, in fact, preserved for the remainder of the 109th Congress. It has to be: the only way the mavericks can get what they want, which is to force Bush to deal with them on a Supreme Court nomination, is if the threat of a Democratic filibuster remains viable—if, in other words, they keep up their end of the bargain and refuse to vote for the nuclear option. The notion being repeated, that the Dems have retained the filibuster "only if they don't use it," ignores the fact of the balance of forces. The Dems don't have to use the filibuster; so long as it remains a weapon in their arsenal the mavericks hold the whip hand, and it remains a weapon so long as the mavericks hold together and 44 + 7 = 51. Posted at length about it at the top of my blog.

The Heretik

No winners. Only losers. Truce, for now. A wafting of a Munich air.
Oy.

Leah A

I'm with Heretik; more than a wiff of "I have here a piece of paper..." cue sounds of the London Blitz.

But let us not generalize this to condemn all Democrats everywhere, please. The Senate caucus did okay; Reid remained stalwart, he was ready with a survival strategy were the Republicans to have unleashed the nuclear option. But he only had 49 votes in his pocket as of Monday, two less than he needed to thwart Cheney's iron thumb tipping Justice's scale to the hard right. Any uncommitted votes were probably among the 14 sitting in that room, moderating. It would have been problematic, politically speaking, for Reid to try and stop an attempt to find a compromise.

And I think Reid did the right thing in proclaiming victory, and then defining it with a rigorous specificity that the moderates were determined to avoid.

So this battle isn't over...for us at the grass roots as much as for the Democratic Party. I'm working on a post about the specifics of that; I have to admit it's been slow going because of those regular eruptions of blinding anger, not helped by hearing that Owens has been approved.

It's true that the fifth circuit is a lost cause, her addition to it will change little about the way it goes about it's business. (Terrible irony; this was the circuit, mostly white southern men, like Judge Tuttle and Judge Frank Johnson, who applied the logic of Brown to put the Federal courts squarely behind the desergregation of the south, at no little cost to themselves.)

Two Democrats voted for Owens, Byrd and Mary Landreau; one Repub voted against her, Chaffee, but damn if both Republicans from Maine voted for her. As Avedon said, Owens doesn't belong on a court, she belongs in jail.

And if I hear one more person pronounce Janice Brown a self-hating black...she doesn't hate herself, she's in love with herself; it's everyone else she hates - particularly unworthy blacks and the corrupt white liberals who empower their negritude, to use an unlovely word those neo-racists at The New Republic are fond of trotting out.

And then I read in the Wa Po a quote from Lindsey Graham that if any of the Democratic seven participate in a filibuster of a Supreme Court candidate, all bets are off. That's a huge revision from what Lindsey was saying Monday evening...it looks like the can hasn't been kicked very far down the street.

Hmm, I started this comment out intending to add a positive glow to the discussion, a project I clearly am not quite ready to take on. Lance, thanks for the ranting-space; now to focus on what's to be done.

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